Question 2 of 3
Not sure if you have arrived at Camp yet @Soubhiville but have a wonderful birthday! We‘ll celebrate around the camp fire tonight 🧡
BarbaraBB @Soubhiville @Suet624 @Susanita @TEArificbooks @Texreader @TheAromaofBooks @TheBookHippie @TheKidUpstairs @TrishB @well-readneck @willaful @youneverarrived @yourfavouritemixtape @Maggie4483 3mo
BarbaraBB @peaKnit @prairiegirl_reading @PuddleJumper @quietjenn @RaeLovesToRead @Read4life @Readerann @RebelReader @Roary47 @rockpools @Ruthiella @SamAnne @Sapphire @sarahbarnes @sblbooks 3mo
BarbaraBB @kspenmoll @kwmg40 @Larkken @Laughterhp @LeeRHarry @Leniverse @Lizpixie @mcctrish @Merelybookish @Meshell1313 @MicheleinPhilly @monalyisha @Nessavamusic @Oryx @CogsOfEncouragement 3mo
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Megabooks Happy birthday @Soubhiville !! Enjoy your day!! 🎉🎉 3mo
BarbaraBB @JenReadsAlot @Jess @jhod @jlhammar @JoyBlue @julesG @julieclair @Julsmarshall @KarenUK @karisa @Karisimo @KateReadsYA @Kimberlone @Kitta @Kristy_K @BookWrym 3mo
BarbaraBB @decalino @DGRachel @elizamarie @ErikasMindfulShelf @Flaneurette @GatheringBooks @Gissy @hes7 @Hooked_on_Books @ImperfectCJ @IndoorDame @JamieArc @jas16 @jenniferw88 3mo
BarbaraBB @Catlass007 @CatMS @Cbee @ChaoticMissAdventures @Chelsea.Poole @Christine @Cseydel @Cuilin @Cupcake12 @dabbe @DebinHawaii @Deblovestoread @Graciouswarriorprincess 3mo
DGRachel Happy Birthday @Soubhiville 🥳 3mo
BarbaraBB @Addison_Reads @AmyG @BarbaraJean @batsy @bennettBookworm @Bkclubcare @Bklover @Bookbuyingaddict @BookNAround @Bookwormjillk @cariashley @Caroline2 @CarolynM 3mo
sarahbarnes Happy Birthday @Soubhiville! I‘ve been thinking about this too. I wonder if it also has something to do with his loneliness. Maybe he expects John to leave like everyone else and he wants to be able to keep the picture so he has someone with him. 3mo
Graciouswarriorprincess Happy birthday @Soubhiville ! 🎉🎂🎈 3mo
Kitta I would guess because he wanted to keep it for himself subconsciously. Or because He doesn‘t want to think about John having a wife. (edited) 3mo
Megabooks Maybe he wants John to live in the present moment with him on the island. Since he was so lonely, maybe he wanted all the attention on himself. 3mo
Leniverse At first he hid the picture because he didn't want to lose his fantasy of her by giving her back to John. But John is there in the flesh, which makes him better company. Ivar is so starved for companionship that the picture, the idea of Mary as someone John has a connection to, becomes a threat. John is all the human company he has, and he wants to be all that John has. 3mo
DGRachel This was odd to me. Doesn‘t he say that he hides her because he doesn‘t want to share her with John, like Mary belongs to him now, and as he gets to know John, he feels like he would lose John‘s attention if he gives the picture back? 3mo
sarahbarnes I think you‘re right @Kitta @Megabooks @Leniverse that he doesn‘t want John to think of her or focus on the picture instead of Ivar. That he wants all of John‘s attention, and perhaps irrationally thinks he can keep him there that way. 3mo
BarbaraBB @sarahbarnes @Kitta @Megabooks @Leniverse I didn‘t think of that at that moment. My simple me thought he never met a woman himself except family and he just wanted one for himself - even though she was just a fantasy. 3mo
JamieArc I also think it‘s about forming a connection that he doesn‘t want to lose and wants to keep to himself. Super interested in seeing where the story goes… 3mo
Nessavamusic Unconscious jealousy perhaps? He has this friend/maybe more and he doesn‘t want to lose him to his life off the island 3mo
TrishB I think he doesn‘t want share- but also maybe that he wants a singular relationship at that point with John and the picture is a distraction 🤷♀️ 3mo
Kitta @BarbaraBB while that‘s true, he hasn‘t met many, if any, other women - why hide the cenotaph? He could‘ve deduced that it belonged to John, given how it was found, and I think that the fact that he stopped thinking about it after talking to John suggests at first he didn‘t want to lose it, then he didn‘t want John to find it and remember his old life. Just my thoughts though. 😆 3mo
BarbaraBB @Kitta I think you‘re right. After he met John he became the companion he looked for in Mary and then he didn‘t want to share John with Mary. How human 😀 @TrishB (edited) 3mo
squirrelbrain Happy Birthday @soubhiville! I thought at first that Ivar was attracted to Mary, and didn‘t even realise that she was important to John. But then, it did seem that he was trying to keep her away from John. 3mo
Oryx I think he initially didn't want to share, but then maybe as the relationship with John grew, he didn't want to remind him of another life. Talking about the picture might break the spell. 3mo
BarbaraBB @Oryx Break the spell. I think that‘s exactly it! 3mo
peaKnit @Oryx I agree. At first I thought he wanted to keep Mary to himself but then I realized he didn‘t want John to long to go away and hiding that picture seemed simple for Ivar, out of sight out of mind. 3mo
Karisa It‘s so human to want to keep something that reminds us of others and entertain. Photos must have been such a novelty then and without access to media, I can‘t imagine the solitude! The photo thing made me a little sad for them both and for Mary too. Why wouldn‘t John bring her? She seemed ready for an adventure. 3mo
CBee Don‘t have much to add 😊 Agree with everyone! 3mo
mcctrish I‘m with @CBee and @DGRachel I thought initially the combination of the interesting style of photo and Mary is an attractive woman that Ivar wanted it for himself #prettythings like the teapot, there are no luxuries on the island but also by not showing John ( it wasn‘t really hidden) it doesn‘t fuel John‘s desire to leave 3mo
JenReadsAlot I agree with the comments already made! 3mo
Deblovestoread The novelty of the photo was really interesting. It is easy to assume Ivar had never seen one before and it captivated him immediately. The only thing more captivating was a live person, photo might spoil that so needed to be hidden away. 3mo
Meshell1313 I loved this- jealousy and collecting beautiful things maybe? I saw it as if John is reminded of her he‘ll always be trying to leave and get back to her. Ivar wants John to forget her and stay with him. 3mo
BarbaraBB @mcctrish I love your comparison to the teapot. He wanted to cherish beautiful things and the teapot even made it to the cover of the US edition - it must mean something 🫖 3mo
Megabooks @Oryx great point about not wanting John to remember another life. 3mo
Megabooks @mcctrish I know! That broke my heart how he had to hide any nice thing on the island. He seems to have lost so much. I don‘t think he could bear to lose more. 3mo
RaeLovesToRead I don't think he fully knew why he did it and I think his reasons changed as their relationship developed. 3mo
squirrelbrain @karisa - it made me sad too. I think probably John couldn‘t bring Mary as ‘society‘ would have frowned on it. (Or maybe John himself was too traditional to consider it as Mary seemed to push through societal norms when she decided to go by herself) 3mo
TheKidUpstairs @RaeLovesToRead I totally agree. I think it was a mystery to him. Kind of like the other quote we're discussing, how he didn't know the depth of his solitude until John came, I think he's only starting to explore the reasons for taking and hiding the picture. I think the two are connected. The picture and John are the first two connections he's felt with people since his family passed/left, so a part of himself that he hasn't explored is awakening 3mo
dabbe Could it be too that it was simpler to hide the picture than to try to explain to John (where language is still a barrier) why he kept it in the first place? Maybe he fears John will not understand or be angry with him and that he would then take the picture and leave and Ivar would be left with neither the picture or John in complete solitude again--only now it truly would be a lonely one. 3mo
kspenmoll @mcctrish Agree with you on both counts- so few pretty things in his life & he certainly would not want John to leave- he realizes the woman means something special to John, someone to go back to. 3mo
Maggie4483 Maybe Ivar realizes that he‘s the “third wheel,” that John and Mary have a much stronger bond than he will ever have with either of them, so he is trying to keep them separate. 3mo
BkClubCare Excellent points, I agree. Especially the subconscious jealousy and once hidden, how to explain WHY when language communication is difficult AND I think there is guilt, uncomfortable feelings, and not wanting to confront even within Ivar‘s own self. 3mo
Hooked_on_books I‘m with @mcctrish —well put! I didn‘t get any sense of jealousy or of him trying to keel John and Mary apart. He knows nothing of their relationship other than that she‘s probably special to him (she could be his sister or mother, after all), but for Ivar the photo is a luxury in and of itself. 3mo
Chelsea.Poole Everyone has such great points here! My heart grew like 5 sizes for Ivar when he found that photo of Mary. Can you imagine how that would feel—to see a human face after so many years without seeing another soul?? Even if it‘s not a living, breathing person, just the reminder that others are out there is something to cherish. I think I would hold on to that photo too, in Ivar‘s position. 3mo
Megabooks @Chelsea.Poole that is true that he hadn‘t seen another soul in any way in years. I think that‘s hard to understand in current times. Just in this room, I have all your photos on this thread and Top Chef on the TV. We are saturated in images now!! 3mo
mcctrish @dabbe 💔 3mo
dabbe @mcctrish 💙💚💙 3mo
LeeRHarry Great comments! 😊 I don‘t think I have anything to add. Just that I think that why Ivar hid the photo changed as time went on; from keeping Mary to himself, wanting to keep John to himself and then possible guilt that he had it and had hidden it in the first place. 3mo
CarolynM I think @Leniverse has hit the nail on the head. 3mo
Soubhiville Thanks for the birthday wishes @BarbaraBB ! I spent the day hiking so I‘m just arriving now😁. 3mo
Soubhiville Everyone has said exactly what I thought- at first he felt the picture was the best thing he had, then he begins to feel John is the best thing in his life. 3mo
AmyG I saw him hiding her picture perhaps out of shame. Shame that he had it, not wanting to explain why he had it and didn‘t return it, perhaps shame that he had feelings for a man. 3mo
GatheringBooks Happiest of birthdays, @Soubhiville - sorry for being a day late to camp!!! 3mo
GatheringBooks Love reading all the thoughts here - i agree most with @BarbaraBB with the fantasy bit. I think it was just human nature to want to keep something that brings you life and beauty - light to his drab and lonely existence. 3mo
youneverarrived I thought the same as @dabbe 3mo
Caryl So many great thoughts here! I agree that it's a bit of a mystery, even to Ivar himself. Like @dabbe shared, I think Ivar felt uncomfortable about giving John the photo now, after John's gone through his own things and not found it there. I love how much this photo adds to the story, not only giving us an understanding of the time period and insight into character relationships, but also nudging the narrative to John and Mary's backstory. 3mo
dabbe @youneverarrived 🤩😀🤗 3mo
dabbe @Caryl Love how you worded this, especially this part: “nudging the narrative“. 💚💙💚 3mo
Caryl Thank you, @dabbe 😊 3mo
Roary47 I was thinking along the same lines as @Megabooks where he wants John and himself to live if the present moment. The picture could remind John that he should eventually head back and like @Leniverse said it‘s better to have someone physically there than a picture. Everyone has such great thoughts. I‘m excited to continue reading with you all through camp. 🥰 3mo
julieclair Excellent thoughts! 3mo
Bookbuyingaddict @Chelsea.Poole totally agree ☺️and beautifully said . He almost became mesmerised by the photo - I wondered if Mary was the only other woman he‘d ever seen not his grandmother , mother or sister . All excellent comments 🙂 @BarbaraBB @squirrelbrain 3mo
squirrelbrain Good point @Bookbuyingaddict that he‘d maybe never seen another woman other than family. 3mo
BarbaraBB @Bookbuyingaddict COVID… Will it ever stop? Glad you‘re feeling better and stepped by ❤️ 3mo
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